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The Separation of Church and State

“History, I believe, furnishes no example of a priest-ridden people maintaining a free civil government. This marks the lowest grade of ignorance of which their civil as well as religious leaders will always avail themselves for their own purposes.” ~Thomas Jefferson.

“That’s the phoniest argument there is. (Referring to separation of church and state) This whole nation was founded as one nation under God.” ~Sen. James Inhofe (R-Okla.)

Different Americans, Different Traditions

Variety is the spice of life, and different Americans have different traditions. Consider one hypothetical American family’s much-loved Uncle Mert…

Sister Emily

When Uncle Mert visits his sister Emily’s home, Mert and his sister’s family all sit around the dining room table, eat roast and vegetables, followed by dessert. Then they retire to the living room couch and chat over several cups of coffee.

Brother Ralph

But when Uncle Mert visits his brother Ralph’s home, he arrives at 4 AM. Uncle Mert and Ralph don their cold-weather gear, load up the truck, and go spend the daybreak hours in the woods hunting.

Cousin Dave

Uncle Mert has never visited his cousin Dave’s house. And Dave has never even called Mert, even though they live in the same state. As far as Dave’s concerned, Uncle Mert doesn’t even exist.

Sister Martha

However, when Uncle Mert visits his sister Martha’s home, Martha makes him wear a suit and tie. Martha leads him straight to the dinner table, and serves a plate full of Brussels sprouts. Martha’s family and Uncle Mert really love to get together and eat Brussels sprouts.

Martha loves eating Brussels sprouts with Uncle Mert so much, that she wants everybody else to spend their time with Uncle Mert the same way she does — she thinks everybody should spend their time with Uncle Mert eating Brussels sprouts, and ONLY eating Brussels sprouts.

Freedom to Choose

Church and State Fortunately, Martha’s relatives live in the United States. Martha’s relatives are not required to spend their time with Uncle Mert eating Brussels sprouts; they’re free to share their time with Uncle Mert in any way they choose.

Likewise, the U.S. Constitution guarantees that every American can spend (or not spend) time with their best friend — even if that friend is a deity — whenever and however they desire. What’s more, Americans aren’t forced to spend time with friends or deities they’d rather not get to know.

And if Martha doesn’t want to live according to the U.S. Constitution, she is free to pursue citizenship in another country of her choice.

Thanks to Blue Gal for getting this rolling.

12 Responses to “The Separation of Church and State”

Xman says:

Friday, April 6, 2007 at 11:14 pm

I know what you are saying, Joe. Unfortunately, since only 3% of the USA knows what critical thinking/scientific method is, we are all subjected to/at the mercy of sister Martha and those like her…at the polls.

Reply
JoeC says:

Saturday, April 7, 2007 at 7:12 am

I think that’s why the Blog Against Theology is such a great idea…the Christian Right has hogged the media/public consciousness on this matter for the last decade, and hammered their message into all the non-critical thinking (or don’t-have-time-to-think…) masses.

Now a lot of good people believe that anybody for separating church and state, anybody against prayer in schools, etc., are a bunch of radical ACLU nuts. The fact is, there are very good reasons for separating church and state, and they’re not all anti-religion. And it’s good to see things like that FirstFreedomFirst video and realize that anybody that is a citizen is by definition a proponent of church-state separation, or they’re an enemy of the constitution that the founding fathers drafted.

To use a religious metaphor, I know I’m preaching to the choir, but some things can’t be stated enough. And I DID like that video…very well done!

Reply
Tengrain says:

Saturday, April 7, 2007 at 9:21 am

Bravo JC!

Great use of brussel sprouts, too, I must add.

Regards,

Tengrain

Reply
JoeC says:

Saturday, April 7, 2007 at 12:07 pm

My Pleasure. You, Blue Gal, and the gang are doing a good thing.

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PETE says:

Saturday, April 7, 2007 at 12:40 pm

Seperation is great, but the evolution of the so called MEGA churches and the power that these preachers are begining to wield is getting a bit scary, but worse is how the politicians pander to gain favor with them.

Reply
JoeC says:

Saturday, April 7, 2007 at 1:30 pm

It is VERY scary…
Tune in tomorrow (between eating Chocolate Easter Bunnies) and read a post about a group of religious radicals gaining control in the U.S. that will make Hitchcock films seem like Charles Schulz holiday specials (yeah, I know, my posts have been a little dark and heavy lately…promise to lighten up soon…)

Reply
Balls and Walnuts - more than you ever wanted to know » Spend some time in the Blogswarm says:

Sunday, April 8, 2007 at 11:22 am

[...] From Kristim (at MPS) The Aristocrats Montag at Stumplane life’s journey Chip Berlet (at T2A) Frederick Clarkson (at DKos) A poetic justice (several poems) Driftglass The Quaker Agitator Balls and Walnuts Zaius Nation Birmingham Blues do not read this blog Pandagon commander others otherwhirled Journeys with Jood Fitness for the Occasion after the bridge Reconstitution Hard-boiled Dreams of the World The Daily Pulse Midget Queen The Jewish Atheist Fetch Me My Axe North of Center Doing My Part for the Left (podcast) Liberal Street Fighter Blue Wren Laughing Goo Robert Colgan (at MPS) Flatus the Elder Progressive Historians Virus Head Club Lefty Blue Gal Recovering Liberal Blast Off! Ordinary Girl The Neo-Skeptic Not Soccer Mom Hullabaloo Mock Paper Scissors A Blog Around the Clock An American in Melbourne Everything and more Atheist Revolution About Kitty Half Nixon I Speak of Dreams Feminists Don’t Bake Bread Americans United Blog Dog Emperor At Center Network God Vs. Darwin Action Skeptics Creekside Rascality Frank L. Cocozzelli (at T2A) Biblioblography The Largest Minority Facilitate Wonder Reconsititution From Sorghum Crow (at MPS) Mauigirl’s Meanderings Chris Rodda (at T2A) The Spiritual Humanist Blog The Stormy Days of March The Springy Goddess The Shikon Jewel Clyde the f-ed up cousin of Jimmy Dean (at MPS) Vagabond Scholar Ron’s Blog Journeys with Jood The Learning Curve Pissed in NYC (at MPS) This *is* it. Tangled up in Blue Guy A Stitch in Haste One Act in the Eternal Play of Ideas commander other (at MPS) Thoughts in a Haystack We Are All Giant Nuclear Fireball Now Party Coffee Messiah RadRobin Fitness for the Occasion Peace, order and good government, eh? [...]

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Lynda says:

Sunday, April 8, 2007 at 1:20 pm

Why do brussel sprouts always get the short end of the stick? LOL!

I enjoyed that very much! Thank you.

Reply
JoeC says:

Sunday, April 8, 2007 at 4:03 pm

I don’t know why brussel sprouts are hated so. Actually, I don’t really mind eating them…they’re not THAT bad. Maybe brussel sprouts just need a new image makeover marketing campaign from the brussel sprouts growers association…

Thanks for dropping by Lynda! I enjoyed the Theocracy post on your site, too!

Reply
Stump Lane | Clever, Hilarious, Informative » Blog Against Theocracy: Jefferson’s Wall says:

Sunday, April 8, 2007 at 7:59 pm

[...] The links so far: From Kristim (at MPS)The AristocratsMontag at Stumplanelife’s journeyChip Berlet (at T2A)Frederick Clarkson (at DKos)A poetic justice (several poems)DriftglassThe Quaker AgitatorBalls and WalnutsZaius NationBirmingham BluesGod is for Suckers!There are no Barking SparrowsBeep Beep It’s MeCause for ConcernThe Jaded SkepticCassandra Waites (at T2A)Hot Cup of JoeBig Brass BlogDawne Gee at Clean Cut KidxcsharpshadowxCross LeftTen PercentKilling time, making noisePhillip AllenLive and times of an ex(2)-pat YankDarwin’s DaggerLes EnragesLaelapsDavid 2’s Brutally Honest Random ThoughtsRunesmith’s Canadian ContentNonsensical Ravings of Finely Tuned InsanityBarefoot BumNo More Mister Nice Guy!do not read this blogPandagoncommander others otherwhirledJourneys with JoodFitness for the Occasionafter the bridgeReconstitutionHard-boiled Dreams of the WorldThe Daily PulseMidget QueenThe Jewish AtheistFetch Me My AxeNorth of CenterDoing My Part for the Left (podcast)Liberal Street FighterBlue WrenLaughing GooRobert Colgan (at MPS)Flatus the ElderProgressive HistoriansVirus HeadClub LeftyBlue GalRecovering LiberalBlast Off!Ordinary GirlThe Neo-SkepticNot Soccer MomHullabalooMock Paper ScissorsA Blog Around the ClockAn American in MelbourneEverything and moreAtheist RevolutionAbout KittyHalf NixonI Speak of DreamsFeminists Don’t Bake BreadAmericans United BlogDog EmperorAt Center NetworkGod Vs. DarwinAction SkepticsCreeksideRascalityFrank L. Cocozzelli (at T2A)BiblioblographyThe Largest MinorityFacilitate Wonder ReconsititutionFrom Sorghum Crow (at MPS)Mauigirl’s MeanderingsChris Rodda (at T2A)The Spiritual Humanist BlogThe Stormy Days of MarchThe Springy GoddessThe Shikon JewelClyde the f-ed up cousin of Jimmy Dean (at MPS)Vagabond ScholarRon’s BlogJourneys with JoodThe Learning CurvePissed in NYC (at MPS)This is it.Tangled up in Blue GuyA Stitch in HasteOne Act in the Eternal Play of Ideascommander other (at MPS)Thoughts in a HaystackWe Are All Giant Nuclear Fireball Now PartyCoffee MessiahRadRobinFitness for the OccasionPeace, order and good government, eh? No Comments » [...]

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VirusHead » Mutating bits of contagious discourse, because language is a virus. » Blog Archive » The Posts Against Theocracy says:

Monday, April 9, 2007 at 10:06 am

[...] Look at everybody who participated in the blogswarm against theocracy! Take a look. There are some great reads here. From Kristim (at MPS)The AristocratsMontag at Stumplanelife’s journeyChip Berlet (at T2A)Frederick Clarkson (at DKos)A poetic justice (several poems)DriftglassThe Quaker AgitatorBalls and WalnutsZaius NationBirmingham BluesLihan161051BrianChaotic GoodDangerously Subversive Atheist PenguinNorthgate ScienceAustin AtheistThe GreenbeltEssential SaltesKnight of PanEvil BenderI doubt itXarkAbnormal InterestsTengrain (at MPS)Deleted ItemsBratfinkReligious Right WatchIseBrandMillard Fillmore’s BathtubTimeline of Theocracy (at T2A)HypnocritesProgressiveUThe Skeptical AlchemistDark ChristianityThe Rational ChristianAnother Ravan PerchUnrepentant Old HippieCycleAP Lawrence, BloggerHappy Jihad’s House of PancakesGod is for Suckers!There are no Barking SparrowsBeep Beep It’s MeCause for ConcernThe Jaded SkepticCassandra Waites (at T2A)Hot Cup of JoeBig Brass BlogDawne Gee at Clean Cut KidxcsharpshadowxCross LeftTen PercentKilling time, making noisePhillip AllenLive and times of an ex(2)-pat YankDarwin’s DaggerLes EnragesLaelapsDavid 2’s Brutally Honest Random ThoughtsRunesmith’s Canadian ContentNonsensical Ravings of Finely Tuned InsanityBarefoot BumNo More Mister Nice Guy!do not read this blogPandagoncommander others otherwhirledJourneys with JoodFitness for the Occasionafter the bridgeReconstitutionHard-boiled Dreams of the WorldThe Daily PulseMidget QueenThe Jewish AtheistFetch Me My AxeNorth of CenterDoing My Part for the Left (podcast)Liberal Street FighterBlue WrenLaughing GooRobert Colgan (at MPS)Flatus the ElderProgressive HistoriansVirus HeadClub LeftyBlue GalRecovering LiberalBlast Off!Ordinary GirlThe Neo-SkepticNot Soccer MomHullabalooMock Paper ScissorsA Blog Around the ClockAn American in MelbourneEverything and moreAtheist RevolutionAbout KittyHalf NixonI Speak of DreamsFeminists Don’t Bake BreadAmericans United BlogDog EmperorAt Center NetworkGod Vs. DarwinAction SkepticsCreeksideRascalityFrank L. Cocozzelli (at T2A)BiblioblographyThe Largest MinorityFacilitate Wonder ReconsititutionFrom Sorghum Crow (at MPS)Mauigirl’s MeanderingsChris Rodda (at T2A)The Spiritual Humanist BlogThe Stormy Days of MarchThe Springy GoddessThe Shikon JewelClyde the f-ed up cousin of Jimmy Dean (at MPS)Vagabond ScholarRon’s BlogJourneys with JoodThe Learning CurvePissed in NYC (at MPS)This *is* it.Tangled up in Blue GuyA Stitch in HasteOne Act in the Eternal Play of Ideascommander other (at MPS)Thoughts in a HaystackWe Are All Giant Nuclear Fireball Now PartyCoffee MessiahRadRobinFitness for the OccasionPeace, order and good government, eh? [...]

Reply
VirusHead » Mutating bits of contagious discourse, because language is a virus. » Blog Archive » Blog Against Theocracy Bits 61-75 says:

Monday, April 9, 2007 at 8:29 pm

[...] 67) Hard-boiled Dreams of the World: “Martha�s relatives are not required to spend their time with Uncle Mert eating Brussels sprouts; they�re free to share their time with Uncle Mert in any way they choose. Likewise, the U.S. Constitution guarantees that every American can spend (or not spend) time with their best friend � even if that friend is a deity � whenever and however they desire. What�s more, Americans aren�t forced to spend time with friends or deities they�d rather not get to know.” [...]

Reply

The Separation of Church and State

Different Americans, Different Traditions

Sister Emily

Brother Ralph

Cousin Dave

Sister Martha

Freedom to Choose

12 Responses to “The Separation of Church and State”

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